TOPIC: Choosing a sound board

Following a FB notification that the Crystal Focus was back in stock at TCSS, I scurried over with half a mind to buy one, but arriving at the page, I thought "Is this really what I need?" I know that the CF is ostensibly the best board out there, but it comes with a lot that might, for some, be superfluous. I keep coming across places to compare soundboards, only to lose them again the next day, so I thought I'd ask here. I probably wouldn't do the install myself, rather send to someone more accomplished, but I do want to have "the right board."

Color mixing profiles seem to invariably mean less brightness compared to dedicated color LED modules, so I'd rather use those, with quick connects. FoC doesn't appeal to me, I could do without that feature completely. If the only features that really matter to me are the ability to support multiple sound fonts, and, ideally, a wide variety of motion detection, what would you say is the most cost-effective board?

With the features you've listed that are important to you and the other inclusions (where applicable to specific board) as secondary interest, I dare say if you were planning on DIY, can't go too wrong with NBv3 or PRIZMv4. If the install is more than likely performed by someone else and you're not wanting to go CFv8, CSv3 casts a pretty wide net catering to broad usage and functionality.
It isn't an open comparison rather just the different PlecterLabs, if others can verify existence of open comparison, you may have to go the multiple Tabs option and min/max each site page.

On another forum I heard someone describing their experience with the board. The said something along the lines of,"Well, what if I don't want 1138 blinkies, or combo sounds, or an RGB blade? The Crystal Focus just seemed unnecessary. But then I took my CF saber out for a duel. Every swing had a swing sound, every clash had a clash sound. And that, my friends, is why this board is the best." Now, that being quoted, I'm sure that cost-effectiveness is not in the CF's favor. It is really $@ expensive.

I'm not too put off by the 150 price tag on TCSS, but it's hard to justify with the perceived "value" of the features that matter to me. I end up thinking "Where is the bulk of that $150 going? Color mixing? Large font bank? FoC?"

Great insight so far, though, guys. I appreciate it.

Don't forget about the NEC boards. I don't have too much experience with them, but I've heard great things about the motion sensors on the Igniter board, and if the on-site descriptions are to be believed, even the less-expensive Spark has the same motion-sensing tech.

Also keep in mind that that Crystal Focus is going to need two lithium ion batteries to run properly, unless you're willing to remove the 5V regulator to make a single lithium-ion work, but then audio quality suffers a bit, and you have to wonder why you didn't just grab a Nano Biscotte or Prizm. On the flip side, the NEC boards have amps specifically chosen to work with a single lithium-ion, as well as the option to wire in a second amp card if you're feeling adventurous.

On a final note, a lot of motion sensitivity has to do with making sure the soundboard is installed by the pommel for maximum sensitivty, as well as calibrating the on-board settings, regardless of the board.

Though that's true, doesn't the Crystal Focus now have two sensors so that it can accurately detect swings even if you put it right below the choke point? But I probably don't know what I'm talking about here, not in the shadow of Kouri, the resident electronics master of the SF (and other) forums.

If I got a soundboard, I'd probably choose the Nano Biscotte. Mostly because of the price, and I wouldn't go with an NEC board solely because I really like Rob Petkau's (GCS guy's) Rogue sound font, and it only works on the Plecter boards. A board choice because of a sound font, stupid I know. So sue me.

Ryan-Rising wrote:
It's one of those best-practice vs real-world scenarios. The Crystal Focus manual even has a page on mounting the board by the pommel, but then ends it with a couple of lines mentioning it's less of an issue with the CF because of it's advanced motion sensors.

Heck, I've got an old Graflex chassis that's made to mount older CF and UltraSound boards right behind the blade holder, and the US board does a decent job with motion sensitivity bumped up - I imagine a recent CF card would work just fine in that position.

That's probably as good a reason as any. I mean, technically it's possible to edit a Plecter soundfont to work with an NEC board, but the font's always going to sound best on the board it was made for - and 90% of the reason we go for soundboards is for a nice set of sounds.

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Also, just want to touch on a point. I know I tend to go, "Yeah, there's Plecter, but check out NEC" - I'm hoping nobody's taking it as a knock against the NB/PC/CF cards. Plecter Labs has very well earned its reputation, and the CF is considered -the- top of the line card for very good reason. I don't think I'll ever say anything *bad* about one of Erv's boards.

However, stock is less of an issue with the NEC Spark, Spark Color, and Igniter boards, and they'll all handle 12W+ LEDs more easily than a Plecter board would.

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Umm~ maybe a Saber-Forge specific breakdown of each card?

Nano Biscotte

Pro:

• Cheapest of the enthusiast boards
• Available pre-wired at TCSS
• Multiple Soundfonts
• Swing, Clash, FoC
• Small enough to fit into thinwall bladestock chassis
• Runs on a single lithium-ion battery

Con:

• 6W+ LED limit on main channel
• No lockup. No Blaster Block

... Actually, I'm a bit short on time, I realized. I'll continue this list later on.

I just did my 1st mhs saber with the nano biscotte (will put up a review soon for people thinking about trying mhs on thier own) and I am feeling a little bored with it already - no aux button options... Blaster, lockup etc.

I just got back a converted graflex with a spark 2 and Im loving it - more bells and whistles but about $40 more than NB

I'm having a hard time seeing myself getting much mileage out of blaster deflect/lockup either, but I'm definitely eager to see your review, Burns.

MHS is nice but the bodies are never in stock

Borommakot wrote:
Its not just the blaster and lockup... Its led power, one color, no led pads, 2 sound fonts etc.

Kouri wrote:
PLEASE keep this going!

BoostinIX wrote:
I've got a bit more reading up to do.

The one thing that stands out is Petit Crouton and Crystal Focus not being very compatible with Saber Forge LEDs. A 6W+ will work wired up to the Main LED contacts (or a half-powered 12W+), but the second and third LED contacts can't be used - they require individual positive terminals for every LED, and Saber Forge LEDs are built with a common-positive. Also, the voltage regulator needs to be removed from the board to work with the SF 18650 battery - I imagine most users would be scared away at the thought of prying parts off a $150 board.

PRIZM should be fine for a 6W+ on one or two channels, or a 12W+ with the LEDs split between two channels, but the amperage limit means you'll still need to run the 12W+ at half-power. Not sure if the 2.5A limit is a limit of the board or an assumption Erv made about battery tech, but there is that 2.5A/7.5W limit in the board manual.

Kouri, you did a great job starting with the NB pros and cons. I'm not looking to give you more work but were you going to list some of the other boards and their pros/cons?

I do like the amount of options you have with a Spark Color 2. What were the changes for NB v3 compared to the v2? I'm trying to find out as much as I can like everyone else for my own possible install.

I'll eventually cover everything, but I'll need to do more research. All that NB stuff was just off memory - I'm not too familiar with the mid-range boards.

As for NBv2 and v3, as far as I remember, the *only* difference is v2 needs a separate board for a FoC LED, while v3 has the FoC circuits built-in.

NBv3 also has a PEX built into it, so it should be able to drive 12W / 12W+ without any issues.

BZArcher wrote:
Really common misconception based on a misunderstanding on how both the PEX and PEX-hack work.

Main LED channel still has the same amperage limit. Included PEX just means you don't need a second board for FoC.

If you want to run a 12W LED on a Nano Biscotte, V2 or V3, you have two options:

1) Run a half-powered 12W+ on the main LED channel.
2) Run two LEDs as a 6W color on the main channel and save the other two for the FoC channel (probably need to underdrive these as a 3-4.5W color).

Also, from studying the boards side-by-side, NBv3 seems to have a different motion sensor, but there's no mention of the change in the manual.

Kouri wrote:
Would it be possible to use the separate Power Extender to drive the main 12w+ LED at full power? Is that a third option?

So if I wanted to have the option of using FoC or Flicker on clash, have multiple sound font options, good motion sensors using a 12W+ LED, which board(s) would be the best options? How would you rank them?

Which LED would be the brightest and best to use for FoC?

Thanks

Ryan-Rising wrote:
It's never really been about the Power Extender.

The reason 12W+ LEDs don't work on Nano Biscotte is the transistor on the Main LED channel - the transistor is only rated at 2-2.5A, and a 12W+ runs at 4A. When I say a 12W+ needs to be run at half power, I really mean that each LED needs to be driven at 500mA, resulting in a 2A unit that consumes about 6W (but is still a bit brighter than a typical 6W+).

What folks did (and probably can still do) is solder on a second transistor alongside the existing to bump that current limit up to 4-5A, allowing use of a 12W+ LED. The *only* reason it's called the Power Extender Hack is because the Power Extender boards happened to have the required transistor on board, and were an easy source for folks that didn't want to hunt the part down on Mouser or DigiKey.

By the way, the part on NBv2/PoweExtender is a SI2302 transistor. It looks to be the same on an NBv3, but I've not seen anyone attempt it - and it's not something I have any interest in doing.

So for emphasis - no one was using a PEX to run a 12W+ LED. There's no way to use a PEX as-designed to enable a 12W LED, and this is why integrated-PEX-on-NBv3 doesn't allow 12W LEDs. Folks were just harvesting parts from it to bump up the NB's ability (either by literally removing the transistor from the PEX board and soldering it to the NB board, or by wiring the Transistor via unorthodox wiring to the NB while it was still on the PEX board).
Andi-Jae EL wrote:
Any of the NEC boards, really. They all support FoC and/or Flicker, the cheapest option (Spark 2) allows two soundfonts and a third sountrack mode, while the flasgship (Igniter 2) allows 16 sound banks, which basically means you can load up 16 fonts, but mix-and-match individual sounds between the banks for hundreds of custom combinations.

All of the NEC boards use the same motion-sensing tech which should be on-par with some of the previous CF boards (to the point that they'll even detect a twist gesture. You could build a Corran Horn Speeder Bike saber that swaps crystals/fonts/blade-color when you twist the hilt).

If I remember right, all three board run on two switches by default. Main can be latching or momentary, but Auxiliary must be momentary. You can also reconfigure the boards to run on a single Momentary with other features being shifted to gesture control. For example, to trigger Lockup on a two-button setup, you press-and-hold the Aux button. To trigger Lockup on a single-button setup, you tap Main immediately after triggering a Clash.

Spark 2 if all you want is 12W+ compatibility with flicker or 6W/6W color mixing with mixed-FoC and a couple fonts. Also single-color crossguard support.

Spark Color 2 if you want 4-channel color mixing (Think 12W RGBA), 6 soundfonts, and RGB crossguard support.

Igniter 2 if you want 4-channel color mixing, RGB Crossguard, a million blinkies, and saber apps like Simon Says (that's not a joke).

That's~ tricky. "Best" is subjective. I personally like yellow flashes, so if I'm building a Red/Red saber, I might opt for a Green flash so all three mix into a custom orange-yellow flash. Or Amber if I'm on a board that won't color-mix the flashes. Whites tend to mix well with just about everything though.

Whites tend to run brightest - unless you're on a Luxeon Rebel star, then Lime's the brightest color they make.

Lime's a funky composite color - it looks like it sits between Amber and Green, but in reality, it's a composite of everything between Red and Green. It's great for mixing with a Royal Blue for bright white.

For the whites, Cool White is usually the brightest, with Neutral White being about as bright, or slightly dimmer. Warm White is the least bright of the three, but still brighter than most colors.

On my to-do list is to try out some non-standard star combinations. I've got my eye on a single white Cree LED that's brighter than two or three XP-E2s, but I want to make sure it works before I recommend it to anyone.